The Life of the Mind | Faith Resolutions

Transcript

00:00:02:25 – 00:00:25:19
Michael Gewecke
Hello friends, and welcome back to the Pasture Talk podcast. Great to have you with us for another conversation as we come to wrap up what was a pretty short series here on the podcast as we were reflecting sort of along that line of the New Year resolutions, things that we of people of faith might want to engage as we seek to commit to growing in our faith this year.

00:00:25:35 – 00:00:46:24
Michael Gewecke
And as we sort of come into this conversation, we want to lift up the idea of what it looks like in the coming year to commit to study the faith, and we’re going to flesh that out. When I say study, I think that we might come with a very particular idea about what that means. And I think one of our intentions in this conversation is going to be to broaden that.

00:00:46:58 – 00:01:18:07
Michael Gewecke
But it is to say that growing in the faith, growing as disciples, requires a level of effort and a concerted desire, not just sort of not just imagined, not just hope for, but actually done in which the Christian takes time to study the faith, to learn the rhythms of Scripture, to learn how the church has engaged that throughout the centuries, to reflect upon what that means in our own lives.

00:01:18:28 – 00:01:39:42
Michael Gewecke
And then ultimately, all of that serves the task of helping to shape and form us as people who live in the world as a reflection of that truth which has been handed through the generations which we have studied and learned, which both lives in our minds, but also animates our hands and our feet. And I think that that is a very large task.

00:01:39:43 – 00:01:51:39
Michael Gewecke
It’s certainly a broad conversation to have, but I think an essential one, because if you’re going to dedicate yourself to growing in some aspect of your faith this year, it is most certainly going to require some kind of study.

00:01:51:57 – 00:02:30:59
Clint Loveall
Yeah, I think you really help us out, Michael, giving us those two words, study and learn. Historically, we’ve talked about studying the faith, studying the scripture. Unfortunately, I think for many people that has the connotation of preparing for a test, of trying to learn the answers and access head knowledge, and really maybe a more helpful way to think about it is that that concept of learning to try and learn what it means to live out the faith, to try and learn the Scripture, not just what’s in it, but what it means and how it guides us.

00:02:30:59 – 00:02:57:00
Clint Loveall
And so if study trips you up, if that doesn’t sound like something that is very appealing, try substituting this idea of learning that we as Christians commit ourselves to a process of learning. We never believe that we get to a point where we know enough about who God is, who we are, and how to follow Jesus Christ. There is always more to understand.

00:02:57:18 – 00:03:20:56
Clint Loveall
There’s always more to explore, there’s always more to do. And so when we come into the faith, we essentially embark on an endless journey of learning, of of trying to process, of trying to understand, of trying to know more. And I think in some ways, Michael, that in our day and age is a is a more helpful word perhaps.

00:03:21:41 – 00:03:45:59
Michael Gewecke
Yeah. And if you have been around the church for some time, you know that there are different communities within the larger church. There are what we call denominations and there are also theological traditions, different branches of the church, families of the church throughout time have emphasized different aspects of the faith. And there’s a beautiful kind of witness of an all of those are together.

00:03:45:59 – 00:04:14:04
Michael Gewecke
But in the focus of this conversation, we need the name from the front and a little bit of where we come from because our perspective, I think, does guide our perspective on this conversation. We come from the reformed tradition. We come from the tradition of theologians and theology and biblical interpretation that follows John Calvin. And we have our own lineage that goes that way in light of the fact that we’re presbyter.

00:04:14:04 – 00:04:41:07
Michael Gewecke
Brian But realistically, when we think of study, when we think of the life of the mind as it relates to our faith, we have to confess from the start that we’re in a tradition that’s generally taking that very, very seriously. We are a group of Christians who gives a lot of thought to the scriptures, gives a lot of thought to the confessions of the church, both within our own tradition and the historic traditions of the church.

00:04:41:07 – 00:05:02:33
Michael Gewecke
And so we kind of come to the conversation in some ways, both with a pro and a con. I think the pro is well practiced. We’re rehearsed in the idea that if we’re going to come to the faith and grow as disciples, we’re going to need to bring the life of our mind. That’s a good thing. Then maybe the con that will come in the conversation is also we’ve been there.

00:05:02:33 – 00:05:23:34
Michael Gewecke
We’ve been at junctures of the faith where people have overthought it and not lived it. It has become a fixture of the library in their brain, but it’s not been particularly animating or it hasn’t been particularly seen in the way that they live in the world, but their hands and feet. And that’s the kind of messy intersection that we inhabit.

00:05:23:34 – 00:05:26:31
Michael Gewecke
And I think it does have a way of influencing the conversation.

00:05:26:58 – 00:06:08:36
Clint Loveall
Yeah, I think it’s helpful background to know that Presbyterians have always valued learning knowledge, education. The reason that many Presbyterian ministers still wear robes and wore robes historically was the idea that they were academic gowns. They signified that a person who was a member of the clergy had studied. We still require for pastors in most circumstances that they go through a very specific and scripted educational process, a master’s degree, or generally a three year program that even for the most part still includes trying to study even the languages of of Greek and Hebrew.

00:06:08:36 – 00:06:40:39
Clint Loveall
So we do have a lot of additional educational requirements placed on our clergy. On the other hand, in our laity, you know, the average Presbyterian has graduated high school, probably been to college, most I would say, have graduated college, particularly if you look at the younger generations. We are a people that have traditionally taken some stock in and valued the idea of education.

00:06:40:39 – 00:07:10:39
Clint Loveall
And one of the things that’s done for us, Michael, in fact, I, I think this is a thing of which Presbyterians can be proud. I think that our background in terms of education has really helped us be open. You know, Presbyterians have not historically gotten real caught up in the kind of like evolution debates, and we’ve not been real fearful of science or of social sciences, psychology.

00:07:10:39 – 00:07:37:44
Clint Loveall
We we have been able, because we trust the educational process and because we essentially rely on the idea that all truth belongs to God, embraced learning. We’ve said whatever science uncovers could be a tool that helps us understand God’s world. Whatever psychology discovers might be a tool that helps us learn something about ourselves. And so on the whole.

00:07:37:44 – 00:08:13:42
Clint Loveall
Michael I mean, there have been exceptions, but on the whole, Presbyterians have not been afraid of education. In fact, I think just the opposite. I think we have embraced it and, and Presbyterians have served in many academic fields and and been people who within those fields are somewhat rare in trying to integrate faith and learning, you know, to try and be a faithful Christian and a physicist, a faithful Christian and a chemist, a biologist, whatever that may be.

00:08:13:42 – 00:08:28:22
Clint Loveall
And and I think that’s given us a valuable I think that’s given us a valuable voice in those conversations, though, I think they maybe don’t happen as frequently as they once did. But but I think we’ve added to them.

00:08:28:40 – 00:08:51:12
Michael Gewecke
So I don’t want this conversation to go autobiographical, but it may be relevant. You know, I grew up in a tradition. I actually grew up Pentecostal, So for me, I grew up in a tradition that would very much be in a different camp in the Christian church, where there is a pretty healthy skepticism of the academic process of the life of the mind, there’s a more trust in the experience than there is in the thought.

00:08:51:46 – 00:09:14:49
Michael Gewecke
And then I think that that has its pros as well. But I certainly think that one of the beautiful, distinctive, distinctive of the Presbyterians is they they we have historically and theologically held and you said this, but I want to emphasize it, that at the end of the day, God is Almighty God is providential, God’s creator. Everything stems from and begins with God.

00:09:15:25 – 00:09:34:46
Michael Gewecke
Not everyone can start there. And I want to just name that you might be here in the conversation and that would be a stumbling block for you. I put that in the comments. We’d love to have a conversation. We could help forward you to some things that we’ve covered together that may be helpful, but as a reformed Christian, we start with that affirmation of faith that God is the source of all things.

00:09:34:46 – 00:09:57:46
Michael Gewecke
If that’s true, then we hold very deeply that there’s nothing that we’re going to discover, though we’re going to be wrong a lot of time, right? We’re going to make mistakes. We recognize that often. But the reality is that as we get closer and closer to discovering what is true, we’re getting closer and closer to the gathering, the one who described it all.

00:09:57:46 – 00:10:24:59
Michael Gewecke
So there’s really not this feeling of anxiety. There’s not a feeling of threat. There’s more a spirit of inquisitiveness. So spirit of creativity, I’ll even say at its best, there’s a kind of desire to be increasingly humbled by the exploration portion of what is and what God has made, because we deeply hold to this belief that whatever we uncover that is true will ultimately be a thing of God.

00:10:24:59 – 00:10:51:46
Michael Gewecke
And if what we’ve discovered isn’t true, then we’re on a red herring. We’re on a path that doesn’t lead us to truth. And ultimately God, by the power of the Spirit, will lead us in the direction that God desires closer to truth. So there’s an act that I think is the summary of this chapter of the conversation. There’s an orientation towards deeper study, towards the life of the mind, to asking difficult questions and seeing where they go.

00:10:52:04 – 00:11:12:41
Michael Gewecke
And I think Presbyterians have historically, to your point, Clint, not only ask those questions faithfully, not only have they walked forward with a great deal of faith and humility, but I think by and large we have found that to be animating and not something that has slowed us down or made the faith more difficult. I think we found that to be engaging.

00:11:13:15 – 00:11:50:43
Clint Loveall
And I think the beautiful opportunity in that, Michael, is that it has given us a chance to use our faith as a filter by which we encounter other things, other ideas, other truths at our best. We’ve not been intimidated. So Presbyterians can throw themselves into great literature that doesn’t have the label Christian on it. Presbyterians can throw themselves into the fields of science and ask real questions about how things happened and what is the nature of the world we live in.

00:11:51:05 – 00:12:38:43
Clint Loveall
And understand that as we discover that it points us not away from God, but towards God. And I think, you know, we are somewhat rare in the idea that we use our faith to filter that kind of knowledge, that kind of learning in a way that’s not detrimental, that’s not dangerous to faith. You know, Presbyterians, by and large, aren’t haven’t been overly concerned with whether something bears the label religious or Christian on it, because if we find truth in it, we celebrate that believing that that points us toward God and to the to the application for this conversation.

00:12:38:43 – 00:13:17:09
Clint Loveall
Michael, I think you started with it. Part of what that means is that when we talk about study, we don’t simply mean opening the Bible and memorizing chapter and verse. We now we do mean that that’s a great thing that involves blood. But study for the reformed Protestant, Presbyterian, Christian can be much bigger than that. We we may we may dedicate ourself to learning in an area that we don’t feel we know much, but we may read The Brothers Karamazov and listen in it for truth about how we live and who we are.

00:13:17:09 – 00:13:36:23
Clint Loveall
We might, you know, throw ourselves into things that don’t seem like Christian study. And yet we may learn in those fields things that deeply inspire and increase and inform our faith. And I think that’s that’s important.

00:13:36:37 – 00:14:03:36
Michael Gewecke
Right? Exactly. That is I think the point that I’d like to emphasize is that as we look as reformed people out at the world, we see these glimmers of God’s revelation, these slivers of truth, none of them that are the full encompassing breadth of God’s truth. That’s the thing that we see fully in Jesus Christ. But when we turn to see that revelation, we turn to Scripture.

00:14:03:36 – 00:14:32:49
Michael Gewecke
And I think it is up first to mind for me at least, as you were talking to think of the selection here from James, I mean, James chapter one here, he’s talking about being doers of the word. And I think that there’s a real important turn that happens in the conversation when we get to verse 22, because we’re told be doers of the word, not merely hearers who deceive themselves for their hears of the word, not doers.

00:14:33:01 – 00:15:10:06
Michael Gewecke
They’re like those who look at themselves in the mirror. And for they look at themselves and are going away. They forget what they were like. And I think the point there that I reflect on as it relates to this conversation is that at the end of the day, as we reflect, as we seek to learn this, we turn to things like Dostoyevsky’s book that you mentioned, or as we look at a particular field of science, or if we engage in that conversation with a different discipline, we don’t do that because we think that ultimately just storing that knowledge in our mind is going to result in us being more faithful.

00:15:10:06 – 00:15:54:21
Michael Gewecke
No, all of that is subject to the humility that comes from sitting at the feet of Jesus Christ. And ultimately all of that will be measured not just by our ability to hear, but ultimately, ultimately by that way of thinking, transforming our lives so that we ever more and more look like Jesus himself. And I think there’s this idea of framing our study that we might commit to not just as book knowledge per say, though, that may be a lot of the time that we spend years reading and engaging with another, but rather with the intent of doing that so that it might actually be seen in our hands and our feet what we do

00:15:54:21 – 00:15:55:31
Michael Gewecke
in the lives that we live.

00:15:55:57 – 00:16:20:11
Clint Loveall
I think John Calvin know famously said Michael something to the extent of to know God, we must know self so that our faith, what we understand of God, is that overlap between our knowledge of God and our knowledge of self. And so again, whatever road we pursue to that is a faithful road. It is something of the faith.

00:16:20:11 – 00:16:54:01
Clint Loveall
And, and whether that’s scripture or whether that’s some other discipline, those things point us in that direction. And to your point, you know, you’re exactly right. The idea is not knowledge for its own sake. The the idea is that knowledge uncovers for us something deeper of the God that we serve and seek and follow. And so when we open Scripture, the point is not simply to just know what’s in the Bible.

00:16:55:12 – 00:17:21:21
Clint Loveall
The point is to understand how those words and stories and texts point us toward an understanding of who God is. What what do we learn about God from the Scripture? Simply memorize missing verses and knowing the stories. I mean, that’s a good foundation. We need to have that, but it’s not the end. The point is bigger than that.

00:17:21:21 – 00:17:44:09
Clint Loveall
The point is that as we encounter these texts, that as we study, that, as we try to get underneath of them and understand them, they point us toward understanding something of God. And so it’s not the knowledge itself that is ultimately our goal. It is the one who is the author of knowledge. It’s the one who is the author of Truth.

00:17:44:09 – 00:18:11:04
Clint Loveall
And that’s a very important distinction because there are people who can quote chapter and verse but don’t live it out. And we couldn’t say that they know the faith. We could say they know the scripture, but we but unless somebody can say we live the Scripture, we live the faith, then our knowledge is wasted. Our knowledge isn’t helping us be better disciples of Jesus Christ.

00:18:11:04 – 00:18:31:19
Clint Loveall
And that is ultimately the point of all. Truth is to lead us deeper into relationship with the one who is true, who is the truth. And so I think that’s something we just have to keep in mind whenever we talk about Presbyterians and Life of the Mind and reading and study, all of those things are great. But they are ins.

00:18:31:44 – 00:18:45:54
Clint Loveall
They they are means to an end. They are not ends in themselves and the end to which they are the means is a deeper understanding of who God is, who we are, and what it means to be God’s people.

00:18:46:21 – 00:19:18:25
Michael Gewecke
So a short survey where we. Ben right, we come to this conversation with that sincere belief that our equipping our faith can be done with the intentional practice of study, of making even a resolution. I’m going to commit to broaden my faith in discipleship this year that that might not just be done within the faith context itself, but I would like to study in such a way that I will not only learn more about God, but that God might be seen more and more in and through my life.

00:19:18:25 – 00:19:39:12
Michael Gewecke
And so a person might come and say, At this juncture, the conversation sounds great. Clint might climb on board. I think I’d love to participate in something like that, but where do I start? And I think we can offer a few practical suggestions making our way for the maybe, you know, the first is is obvious, but I don’t think it should go on said that first would be to study scripture.

00:19:39:12 – 00:20:13:40
Michael Gewecke
The reality is, even in our own tradition, which is a thinking tradition which gives a lot of thought to our faith and a lot of precedents to the life of the mind. We’ve got a lot of work to do on our understanding of the biblical story. We have some work to do memorizing the characters of Scripture. We have some work to do to familiarize ourselves with the places of Scripture and the symbols of Scripture and the stories that we’re both seen in the Old Testament and also the stories that are taught by Jesus and the New Testament.

00:20:13:53 – 00:20:38:38
Michael Gewecke
There’s so much breadth that is worth studying. And to your point, earlier, Clint, I think it’s worth noting that you might commit to I’m going to read a chapter a day or maybe you would go and purchase. They have Bibles that are completely devoted to reading through the whole Bible in the year, and it’s actually chunked out in sections where you can download free reading plans that would accomplish that purpose.

00:20:39:01 – 00:21:06:46
Michael Gewecke
Maybe that looks like an individual. I’m going to read the scriptures this year, and that’s the kind of study that you would resolve to do. But there’s another and I think important thing to note, and that is not just study that’s done in the quiet of your own home and in the individual moments that you set aside. But there’s also real merits in studying the Bible with others, too, hearing other people’s interpretation, hearing what they heard when they read that section, being challenged and encouraged by another.

00:21:06:46 – 00:21:31:37
Michael Gewecke
If you have a group that’s near you, if you have a group in your congregation that does that, or maybe you simply go seek out a group at a congregation, most Christian churches have a group who are continuing on studying scripture that can be a very formative place to read the Bible. And, you know, it also helps as you seek to live the faith to do that with others, because that practice happens naturally.

00:21:32:43 – 00:22:02:54
Clint Loveall
Right. And I think we’ve said many times, Michael, as we’ve had some of these conversations, that the Bible seems very intimidating to people. It’s big, it’s complex, it’s historical, it gives us snapshots of a very different settings of time and culture. Some of it is just not instinctive intuitive. Some of it doesn’t make sense to us. But it it’s also simple.

00:22:03:30 – 00:22:33:07
Clint Loveall
If we want to engage the scripture, we have to open it. We have to read. Now, not everything is equal. I would I would say if you’re new to the Scripture starting in the New Testament, start with one of the Gospels. I would say highlight your questions, but don’t get bogged down by things you don’t understand. Read in a way to cover the material and dig in where you feel inspired and don’t be troubled.

00:22:33:07 – 00:22:59:49
Clint Loveall
Where you don’t find some help. As you said, Michael, get in a group. That’s a wonderful way. You know, we do an online Bible study here. There are other opportunities. There are in-person Bible studies throughout that throughout most traditions, most churches have access to something like that even go so far to think about what Bible you read. You know, if you’re if you’re old, family Bible is a king.

00:22:59:49 – 00:23:26:16
Clint Loveall
James in that language is kind of outdated and difficult. Well, then you might want to think about a more modern translation, an NIV or an ESV or something that is going to be much more readable and probably more understood tangible in the way that it’s written. I would say, you know, stay away from maybe Bibles that are called paraphrase as they are.

00:23:26:38 – 00:23:53:54
Clint Loveall
There’s nothing wrong with them, but they’re not direct translations. I would say if you’re looking at a Bible to really try and engage scripture with, I would stick to a translation versus a paraphrase. I would stick to something fairly mainstream. Again, NIV, ESV, something pretty accessible. There are study Bibles, and so that usually has something to do with the helps that are listed.

00:23:53:54 – 00:24:30:57
Clint Loveall
The commentary, the articles, the character studies. Some of those are are very good. And I would say if you stick with, you know, the major threads of translations, what you’ll find in there will probably be helpful. The one caveat I think I’d add is that you’d be honest. I would if I were female. I would stay away from anything that calls itself a women’s Bible just because they tend to go more into that idea of gender than they do the actual background and teaching about the text itself.

00:24:30:57 – 00:24:56:49
Clint Loveall
And so they’re they can be wonderfully devotion. But if you want to learn the text, I would say I would put as many as few labels between study and Bible as possible woman study, Bible youth study Bible, whatever other label you add. I would stick to something that simply calls itself study Bible. I think that will give you the best set of tools to do that.

00:24:57:09 – 00:25:18:12
Clint Loveall
I would be engaged with pastors, with other people that you know, who read scripture, but there really is no way around Michael, at some point just digging into the text. And you shouldn’t be intimidated by that. You shouldn’t feel like, Oh, there days I read and nothing speaks to me. Yeah, yeah, that’s going to happen. That that will happen, right?

00:25:18:41 – 00:25:49:58
Clint Loveall
There are things I don’t understand. Jesus said this thing and I don’t know what it means. That’s okay. Go on to the next thing. Put a star in it, Talk about it later, Look it up later. You know, whatever that might be. I think sometimes we even people who are very comfortable reading books sometimes struggle, struggle with how to read the scripture and, you know, the short version is just get in there, just get in there and start reading and the rest will kind of sort itself out.

00:25:50:02 – 00:26:13:30
Michael Gewecke
Yeah, I don’t want to belabor this, but my only comment add to that is I think a lot of people struggle because they think of the Bible as one cohesive book with one particular kind of voice and thread. And we of course believe that these scriptures, they point us to God. But ultimately, you got to remember this is written over thousands of years or different times and cultures are presented.

00:26:13:44 – 00:26:39:55
Michael Gewecke
Even the four accounts of Jesus’s life, which were, you know, historically very close to each other in their provenance, those books, they they tell very different stories. They have very different emphasis. And so if you come to the Bible expecting it to read like a novel, you bought off of The New York Times best seller shelf at the book store, that is going to be a surprise for you.

00:26:40:04 – 00:27:02:27
Michael Gewecke
My encouragement would be come to the Bible with a very flexible spirit. What am I going to find today? What am I going to read? What world is it going to transport me to? What lesson might it be teaching me? Because the Bible is surprising. Oh, even in the New Testament, one chapter turns to the next and suddenly you’re in a radically different place.

00:27:02:27 – 00:27:21:54
Michael Gewecke
You’re learning a different lesson, you’re encountering a different aspect of the eternal God. And I think that that’s actually part of the wonder and adventure of studying the Bible is that you get to experience those shifts, but it can be very discombobulating if you come into it expecting for it to have a clear throughline, just like a novel, you buy off the shelf.

00:27:21:55 – 00:27:42:15
Clint Loveall
Yeah. To that end, Michael, I think one of the things to be aware of, if you want to get serious about studying Scripture, understanding Scripture, the Bible is probably not going to be the only book you need. There are books that will help you with the background, with cultural information, with translation information. There are commentaries written on that.

00:27:42:21 – 00:28:06:28
Clint Loveall
There are hundreds of commentaries written on each and every single book of the Bible that will dig in depth about specific words and specific ideas. And why does Paul say this? And what else does Paul say? And where else does Paul say it? When was this written? Who who to whom was it written? These are questions that help us get underneath the surface of the text.

00:28:06:28 – 00:28:27:55
Clint Loveall
And I think if you want to get serious about really understand ending some of the scripture, you’re going to find those tools very helpful. Nobody is going to simply open a book like the Book of Revelation and have it make sense to them. It will not and it should not. And don’t do that. Don’t start with the Book of Revelation.

00:28:28:13 – 00:28:53:33
Clint Loveall
I’m begging you, don’t. But there are there are parts of Scripture that there are tools available to help with nearly all of it. And there are parts of Scripture, I think we need that. And so, yeah, don’t think that this if this doesn’t simply make sense to you on its own, use stand in good company. You stand with everybody else.

00:28:53:52 – 00:29:17:18
Clint Loveall
And that’s another thing I appreciate about our tradition, Michael, is because we’ve General Lee embraced the idea of study and learning. We’ve been willing to say out of all the lenses that are out there, which ones can we use to help us interpret the faith, understand the scripture? How does history speak to us? How did this the language speak to us?

00:29:17:18 – 00:29:34:19
Clint Loveall
How does the culture and what we understand of sociology speak to us? And I know that can seem very intimidating on the front end. But if you want to get deeper in an understanding of this book, we call Bible, then I think those are going to be essential tools.

00:29:34:40 – 00:29:55:30
Michael Gewecke
And we recognize not everyone is in the moment. We’re digging into commentaries that address original languages and some of the textual issues that exist. You know, that’s not for everybody at this stage of their faith. For some people, it is. And if that’s you, I certainly hope that you will seek out those materials because you might be surprised how engaging they are.

00:29:56:02 – 00:30:15:39
Michael Gewecke
But that’s all I’ll say about that. I will say some are going to say, you know, I’d like to address a certain aspect of my faith. So there’s a particular kind of stream that I would be interested in learning more about, or there are questions I bring to it. And I think, you know, we’re going have a hard time pointing people to all of those kinds of materials.

00:30:15:39 – 00:30:32:27
Michael Gewecke
And, you know, the faith is large enough that some are going to be more helpful than others. And so the reality is it does take some work to even consider, you know, where am I going to look for materials? But we did try to do a little bit of that work to try to help just throw up on the screen here.

00:30:32:27 – 00:30:57:25
Michael Gewecke
We did do a series a while back called Books Worth Reading, where Clintonites together put together a list of books that have been very instrumental in our faith. We ordered them some things about spiritual discipline, some things about personal faith, some things about spirituality. This last one here was sort of like some more deeper books that we found.

00:30:57:41 – 00:31:14:42
Michael Gewecke
We call that going a step further, books that we found particularly helpful. You know, that’s a place that you might want to turn. Go to a series like that. Look at some of the books that we recommended. If one of them jumps off the page to you, pick that up, give it a read, read the first chapter, you know, on Amazon, whatever.

00:31:15:07 – 00:31:47:27
Michael Gewecke
Maybe that’s a way that you might make your way in. Maybe you don’t start with scripture. Maybe you start with a book by C.S. Lewis, and then maybe you move to the Book of Luke next. You know that that is varied and we’re not here to prescribe a path for you, but we do want you to be aware that there are some books that have been very helpful, not just interpreting Scripture itself, but that are very helpful illustrators or illuminators maybe like flashlights on the face that can help show us things that we might not see by ourselves.

00:31:47:27 – 00:31:57:32
Michael Gewecke
And that can be very helpful as we seek to grow deeper, to resolve, to really help the faith of our mind flourish.

00:31:57:32 – 00:32:35:33
Clint Loveall
You know, for hundreds or arguably for thousands of years, Michael, some of the brightest men and women on the planet focused their efforts on communicating and exploring the faith and there remains today a field of people who think seriously and write seriously about what it means to seriously follow Jesus Christ. And and we now live in an era in which we have access to so much of that.

00:32:35:47 – 00:33:07:46
Clint Loveall
There there are just hundreds, thousands of books worth reading in the faith. Now, they’re not all worth reading. And there is some sorting that needs to be done by tradition and content, and we can be helpful with some of those conversations, as can our tradition. But you need not feel like you undertake this journey alone. And the other thing I would say is, you know, in many of our educational endeavors, Michael, there’s a beginning in an end, right?

00:33:07:46 – 00:33:30:50
Clint Loveall
You go to college some number of years later, you graduate, you go to seminary, you graduate, you go for continuing. Ed, you get the certificate, you get the promotion, you get the whatever it is, Faith is not a field like that. Faith is has no end. There’s no moment at which you get your diploma and you have learned enough.

00:33:30:50 – 00:34:05:06
Clint Loveall
And so the wonderful invitation of that is it’s never too late to start and it’s never too late to do more. But we are always invited to pursue study, to pursue the life of the mind, to learn more about ourselves, our God, our faith, our discipleship, our church. There is almost limitless amount of things that we can pursue to apply to the way that we live as disciples of Jesus Christ.

00:34:05:06 – 00:34:45:50
Clint Loveall
And so, again, while that can be very intimidating, nobody’s going to read a library full of books. There is so much out there that everybody can find something to read or to listen to if you’re not a reader. You know, again, we live in this wonderful era of things like podcasts and audio books and online digital Bibles. I mean, they’re just there’s really no excuse not to be engaged at some level in trying to pursue learning more about ourselves and about the faith, because it’s accessible.

00:34:46:31 – 00:35:11:43
Michael Gewecke
I don’t want to continue on the conversation to infinity. There’s a very simple thread here, and that threat is that there is a wealth, a storehouse, a treasure of resources that exists that will help us to understand and know the God who created all those resources live both within the religion section of the bookstore and outside of them.

00:35:11:43 – 00:35:30:28
Michael Gewecke
And the truth is, as you seek to follow your study, as you seek to learn and grow, as you do that with diligence and intentionality, as you make that resolution, not just something you think is a nice, but as you seek to live it out, you’re going to see fruit. And that fruit should be reflected in the way that you live.

00:35:30:28 – 00:35:51:25
Michael Gewecke
I think my final comment in this conversation is just to say that there is a menu of options. There’s a whole selection of things that you can engage with. And if that is overwhelming, you know, maybe the simplest thing to say is somehow you came on to this conversation. We’re glad that you’re here. You know, the invitation is join us.

00:35:51:25 – 00:36:11:47
Michael Gewecke
You know, we do our daily Bible with you That Monday through Thursday, we dig into the Scripture to try to find what God might say to us in it. We have these conversations every Thursday and we try reflect on different aspects of the faith. The breadcrumbs of that alone may be a helpful guide going down the future. And you know, it’s not because we have a key that unlocks anything.

00:36:12:21 – 00:36:32:24
Michael Gewecke
There’s just simply people trying to learn and to grow. And so if your resolution is, you know, I’m going to watch one less Netflix show, HBO show a week, and I’m going to incorporate one thing that I’ll learn in my faith. Maybe it comes from here. Maybe it comes from a pantheon of other things that you can find online or find in the bookstore.

00:36:32:24 – 00:37:01:40
Michael Gewecke
Great. But we do make choices with what we consider. We make choices with what we put in our minds and our hearts. We make choices by what we read and listen to. And for many of us, I think this might just be an invitation, maybe even a plea. Consider what your putting in that menu of things and maybe this your resolve to add things or to increase the number of things that will help grow your faith.

00:37:02:09 – 00:37:28:12
Clint Loveall
Yeah. And, you know, we’ve we’re putting this out, Michael, near the end of January. And I suspect for a lot of people, the yearly annual New Year’s resolution and some of them at least have probably been tossed by the wayside. But I would encourage you, if this is a conversation that sparked some interest, you know, find a good devotional, find something that helps you read a passage and reflect devotionals every morning.

00:37:28:12 – 00:37:55:33
Clint Loveall
There are wonderful daily devotions. There’s collections of works by C.S. Lewis and others who would be be very beneficial. I’ve been working through one written by a man named Bob Goff. That’s a very good pick up life together, or mere Christianity, Bonhoeffer or C.S. Lewis. And tell yourself, I’m going to get this book finished before next January. It doesn’t have to be in a week.

00:37:56:11 – 00:38:21:32
Clint Loveall
Take your time with it, read a couple sentences, read a paragraph at a time, enough in many of those paragraphs to last a week. If you if you slow down and consider it, take a book of Scripture, maybe a book like Philippians that is small, short, accessible, maybe the gospel of Luke that is pretty manageable and simply begin to wander around in it.

00:38:21:32 – 00:38:44:49
Clint Loveall
You don’t have to memorize it. There’s no test at the end. You don’t have to, you know, do a verse a day. If that’s not your thing, just spend some time with the word, spend some time with the faith and see where it takes you and see what you learn from it. That that’s what we mean when Presbyterians use this very high sounding phrase, the life of the mind.

00:38:45:12 – 00:39:03:55
Clint Loveall
That’s what we mean. Explore some things and see where God directs you because of them or through them. And and I think that’s that’s a wonderful invitation that as we attend to those things, God shows up and participates with us and directs us, and that’s the promise we live under.

00:39:04:15 – 00:39:21:46
Michael Gewecke
Well said. I think it’s a perfect summary. Hope that there’s been something in this that encourages you. I would love for you to have you continue to join us on this journey as we seek to cultivate that life of the mind and seek to be people who are not only are convicted of the faith, but live it out in our day to day lives.

00:39:22:02 – 00:39:36:59
Michael Gewecke
I hope that this will continue to be a source of inspiration, encouragement and challenge for you. And we look forward to seeing you as we continue on with our next conversation. Actually, our next series, which will begin next week, and you’ll hear more about that when it comes. But until then, be blessed.

00:39:37:19 – 00:39:59:54
Clint Loveall
Thanks, everybody. Hey, we want to thank you for listening to this broadcast. We’re grateful for the support and the connections, the relationships we get to make through some of these offerings. We hope that they’ve been helpful. We know that there are lots of choices that you have, lots of things you can listen to. We want to make you aware of some of what we’re doing and we greatly appreciate you being a part of it.

00:40:00:10 – 00:40:19:03
Michael Gewecke
Absolutely. We want to just thank you for being one of our audio podcast listeners. It’s amazing to have you with us in the midst of our conversations. Of course, I hope you know that you can find the whole archive of all of these conversations at Pastor Taco. We would love for you to join us there. You can find options for subscribing by email.

00:40:19:15 – 00:40:52:40
Michael Gewecke
You can easily share things there with other people who you think might appreciate recordings like this. And of course, we just want to welcome you if you’re ever interested in joining us for the video podcast, you can do that on YouTube. It is YouTube.com slash AFP, PC Spirit Lake. There you can comment and engage with us or if you would prefer to do that without going to YouTube, you can actually just click the link in the description of this podcast where you will be able to send us form and information and reach out to us.

00:40:52:53 – 00:41:09:45
Michael Gewecke
We’d love to hear from you and engage in conversation with you. Thanks again for taking time to be with us. We look forward to our next conversation and can’t wait to see you then.